The Beat acquired an opportunity to meet up with Gary Clement and discuss Okay Is in Bother Once more, the creator’s most up-to-date graphic novel, revealed by Little, Brown Ink. That is the second on this cute and endearing collection for younger adults readers, although even common adults would possibly get pleasure from it, too.

Clement has written and illustrated many photos books, amongst them, Swimming, Swimming, Simply Keep Put, and The Nice Poochini, for which he was awarded Canada’s prestigious Governor Basic’s Literary Award in Kids’s Literature in 1999. His illustrations have appeared within the New York Occasions, Boston Globe and lots of different newspapers.

Okay Is in Bother Once more is Clement’s second OGN, following 2024’s Okay Is in Bother a few small nervous baby attempting to determine the right way to navigate the world round him.

Clement chatted with The Beat in regards to the strategy of writing the Okay Is in Bother collection, Franz Kafka, anxiousness, and attempting so as to add a brand new phrase to the lexicon.

Cartoonist Gary Clement

JAVIER PEREZ: Beginning with Okay Is in Bother Once more, is it the second e-book in the collection? Are you able to inform me in regards to the first e-book?

GARY CLEMENT:  Nicely, the primary e-book is appropriately referred to as Okay Is in Bother, as an alternative of Okay Is in Bother Aachieve. Equally, it’s 5 tales a few boy named Okay who, regardless of each effort, all the time finds himself in hassle with some authority, both lecturers, dad and mom, station attendants, or faculty principals. He can not keep out of hassle, and but, although this all the time occurs to him, he’s undaunted. He perseveres via hardship, and he continues to attempt to get via life.

The story is loosely based mostly on a hybrid model of the lifetime of Franz Kafka, my life as a toddler, and the tales of Kafka. So, I‘ve type of woven precise particulars—and that is extra within the first e-book than the second e-book—however there are particulars within the first e-book from Kafka’s precise biography, just like the final story within the first e-book is about his father not letting him in from the balcony. Mainly, he will get locked out of his house, and his father received’t let him in as a type of punishment, which type of occurred to Kafka. His father didn’t put him on the balcony, however he put him out within the form of entrance corridor to the house that they lived in. They wouldn’t let him in as some form of disciplinary motion, and Kafka wrote about this in his letter to his father.

It’s this 80-page letter that he wrote, when he was an grownup, like in his late 30s most likely, and he outlines within the 80 pages a really lengthy checklist of grievances that he has together with his father, one in every of them being that episode in his childhood that traumatized him. Kafka by no means despatched the letter. You realize, he had this very horrible relationship together with his father, whom he felt he may by no means stay as much as his father’s expectations. His father was fairly upset with how Kafka turned out as a result of his dad was this sort of sturdy, wholesome, ex-military man. Kafka was a, you realize, sickly, frail, mental. 

There are elements of the story from my biography. Loads of that has much less to do with my dad and mom, however extra of it has to do with my horrible faculty expertise as a toddler. I used my experiences and positioned them on Kafka or vice versa to specific a sense such as you’re not fairly in the proper place and are usually not actually part of what’s occurring. Okay can’t kind any friendships in his life; he has no friendships in class. The one buddy he could make is with a beetle, which is drawn from probably the most well-known Kafka story, Metamorphosis, wherein he turns right into a beetle.

So, I began this e-book as a straight-up biography of Kafka’s childhood. I assumed I used to be going to do some graphic novel illustration of what his childhood was like utilizing biographical data. There’s sufficient of it to work with, however it morphed into what it turned. I began eager about what precise occasions in Kafka’s childhood made him, like what occurred to him when he was a child, that created that type of worldview. 

PEREZ: That mindset? 

CLEMENT: Yeah, that mindset. It’s so distinctive and idiosyncratic. There aren’t many authors who get their very own phrases, you realize? And with Kafka, we discuss issues being Kafkaesque, generally used appropriately, generally not, however no matter. Nevertheless it’s nonetheless a phrase, and there’s possibly a handful of authors in literary historical past who get their very own phrase, you realize, there’s Dickensian, however Kafka actually cornered the market on a contemporary anxiousness, and what’s the situation of feeling remoted, and I feel that there’s nobody else like him, which is why he will get his personal phrase.

PEREZ: I wished to dig just a little bit extra into the steadiness between the autobiographical and the Kafka historical past, type of when that melted collectively. 

CLEMENT: OK, that was a second when it melted collectively, and that got here collectively once I acquired a really quick residency on the Heart for Cartoon Research in Vermont, which you’ve heard of, sure? 

PEREZ: I’ve not. Are you able to inform me just a little bit about it? 

CLEMENT: I’ll inform you just a little bit about it as a result of it’s a tremendous place. It’s like a cartoon college began by a graphic novelist named James Sturm, who wrote some unbelievable books. Sturm, I suppose, had a imaginative and prescient of getting a spot the place you may actually research the artwork of bookmaking, cartoon making, and graphic novel making. So, via image books I’d completed for youths, I utilized for this residency via one thing referred to as PJ Library. I acquired to go there to spend per week with James and 9 or 10 different graphic novelists, and we had been in a small city in Vermont referred to as White River Junction, which could be very near Dartmouth College. We spent the week simply working after which displaying one another our work, and it was an incredible week. It was a turning level for me, in a number of methods, however that’s once I wrote the primary story of the primary e-book, which is form of when it got here collectively. I can’t say what it was that did that, however I did suppose like, “How do I make the story related to me?” as a result of I nonetheless suppose it’s acquired to be one thing significant to me.

The primary story is about Okay going to high school, being late, and being despatched to the principal’s workplace. The headmistress and lecturers of the college put him down, and the youngsters made enjoyable of him. 

The principal and lecturers are actually based mostly on experiences that I had in elementary faculty, whose identify, even his identify, is horrifying to me. It was Physician Jacober, and he was a monster. He was this monstrous man with a big bald head and a brief, type of dumpy physique, and he was only a imply SOB and terrorized me. So, I introduced him into the story, and he turned like the primary antagonist. I weaved that with the Metamorphosis story; the main focus is Okay and the beetle who saves his bacon and helps him escape the clutches of the principal and get out of college. They change into buddies, and he makes a take care of the beetle to make a narrative in regards to the bug, which is the Kafka story a part of it. They discuss what they need to do after they develop up, and he tells Okay, “Write a narrative about me.” In fact, he does, however a lot later in life. In order that one story type of weaves collectively all three components that I used to be speaking about, like Kafka’s biography, Kafka’s story, and my very own biography. Though Kafka wasn’t a foul scholar, he did have this challenge. When you learn the letter to the daddy, this traumatized him, and from his perspective, in childhood, he had dad and mom who weren’t attentive to him, which comes within the early a part of the story. 

PEREZ: Yeah, it’s very fascinating betrigger the idea of the story takes two exciting turns. One in that it turns autobiographical within the sense that you simply’re speaking about your experiences, and the opposite in that it goals to be a youngsters’s story that makes Kafka’s tales extra approachable. I used to be questioning the way you took place making that option to be like, “Hey, these anxious tales are most likely good for any person younger and want to take care of that type of anxiousness?” 

CLEMENT: Yeah, I firmly imagine in having darker components in youngsters’s tales. I checked out folks like William Steig and Tommy Unger, who wrote tales which have darkness in them, they’ve loss of life and hazard, and children are in peril. After which there are guys like Lemony Snicket, who did a blurb for my first e-book, about youngsters always in turmoil and hassle, or being threatened by nefarious adults. So, I feel there’s a spot for that in youngsters’s literature. I do. I feel that I keep away from something with sturdy messages, particularly constructive ones. I’m simply not a type of storytellers—nothing in opposition to them, I don’t do this.  I wished to jot down a e-book about my impression of rising up, and I feel it’s common sufficient. 

You realize, like there are going to be sufficient folks on the market who’re going to have the ability to relate to that sure, However I feel that the character of childhood is principally you may have a look at type of extra Disney model of it as being a time of marvel or no matter, which you realize, it’s and will be. Nonetheless, it’s additionally a time of questioning, “What’s going on right here? I don’t perceive how this world works,” since you’re only a child, and other people have guidelines which can be laborious to grasp—like, “Why do I’ve to do this?” It’s a must to since you’re a child, and it may be disorienting and terrifying and will form you, or I’m positive it does form many individuals. I do know it formed me. So, I really feel prefer it’s type of an sincere, approachable view of childhood. I feel many individuals will be capable to relate to it, and I feel I informed you the story about that e-book. A consultant I met in Chicago who appeared like a really common man, appeared like a really athletic individual, and simply, I don’t know, appeared higher adjusted than I used to be. I didn’t know him properly. I simply had met him, however he, you realize, he jogged my memory of the coach from Friday Night time Lights, not that I ought to choose folks after they’re dad and mom, and he pulled me apart and stated, “You realize, that e-book actually resonated for me.”  And I used to be like, “You? Like, actually?” You don’t appear to be that type of man, however anyone will be that type of man, or that type of child. I imply, it doesn’t need to be a man, however, you realize, that’s my expertise. However yeah, I feel that state of childhood is disorienting, and that’s type of the world I used to be in. I used to be attempting to. That was my worldview, the “Clement.” I’m going to work on that. I’m going to work on that. 

PEREZ: We’ll throw it in there. 

CLEMENT: Clements, you’ll be able to see Clements.

PEREZ: Nicely, I wished to select up on that, however let me know if I’m off, within the sense that there doesn’t appear to be like said names of characters. 

CLEMENT: Proper, and it was intentional as a result of I feel that, if they’re the headmistress, the principal, otherwise you simply use letters, which I took from Kafka as a result of, who, though he does often use names in his tales, there are lots of individuals who have simply titles—the station grasp, or no matter—so I assumed that confirmed like a transparent, divide between, like, his friends, his childishness and persona, and people people who find themselves just like the station grasp or the principal. They are type of archetypes. Did you ever watch the outdated Charlie Brown animated TV stuff?

PEREZ: Just like the Thanksgiving stuff?

CLEMENT: Yeah, there’s the Thanksgiving one, and bunch of stuff. You’d all the time hear the dad and mom speaking, however like, you’ll by no means hear their voice, otherwise you would by no means hear their phrases. They’re unrelatable like, there’s a type of space the place they will’t meet and type of see eye to eye. 

PEREZ: Yeah, it looks like not solely are they unidentifiable, their perspective or what they suppose is vital in regards to the state of affairs is totally off from the beginning yelling at him for one thing that appears very innocuous, however then him getting misplaced is simply, “Oh properly, you realize. You’ve made your manner again house. It’ll be superb.”

CLEMENT: It’s type of like they don’t see him as he’s like they check with him as “Sir,” however definitely within the first e-book, there are characters that check with him like they don’t actually see who he’s, however he sees them, and he tries to both keep away from or someway maneuver via the world round them however they don’t see him very clearly. They don’t actually know what he’s about, they’re not listening to him, you realize, they’re not good listeners of the opposite characters. The one listener is the woman that he meets within the farm, whose identify he doesn’t really handle to get.

Perez: Which is one thing I wished to ask, she doesn’t get his identify and he doesn’t get a reputation both, however he desires to get her identify, proper? 

CLEMENT: In the direction of the tip he makes two photographs at it, proper? Earlier than the farmer is available in to take the barrel, like, “Oh, I don’t even know your identify. what’s your identify?” He by no means requested anyone that. They by no means get to that time, however it’s too late as a result of they’re coming after which he forgets on the finish. In order that’s vital to him like unexpectedly he has somebody. He doesn’t ask the beetles by identify, however, you realize, I feel the belief there may be that the beetle possibly don’t have a reputation, and he will get sufficient other forms of private data. So yeah, that’s actually vital. And can he ever discover out her identify? Nicely, we don’t know. It’s attainable. 


PEREZ: Proper  I actually took to the e-book and what actually sticks to me is the thought of politeness & anxiousness.  I really feel like in some unspecified time in the future once I was younger, any person yelled at me as an alternative of giving me a hug, and now my whole factor is  I don’t need to be in anyone’s manner.

I should be fully out of the way in which and I used to be pondering that’s a really common theme, proper? And it goes for each adults and younger folks, and I wished to select your mind at that, for those who felt that manner rising up or what made you need to give that type of story, which I feel could be very highly effective. Once more such as you stated, a man that was a buff man to love just a little child who may not ensure what he’s doing. 

So it was the distinction between being well mannered and being anxious, I really feel like there’s conditions in my life the place I simply have to get this completed, so I’m out of the way in which of individuals and any person would have a look at me like, why are you being so nervous about this factor? 

CLEMENT: Yeah, I imply to begin with you stated some adults really feel that manner too. I feel adults really feel that manner l due to how they felt as youngsters, there’s a direct line, it’s linear, you realize? Or the issues that you simply discovered as a child, and except you make a aware effort to take care of them, you carry them, you drag them with you into your grownup life and I feel there’s this concept, Okay could be very well mannered, he avoids folks however that’s not gonna minimize it. For him when it comes to making his manner via the world as a result of he’s coping with people who find themselves simply not open to him in any manner. So being well mannered or not being well mannered shouldn’t be a method, that’s gonna work.

Which I suppose creates anxiousness since you suppose, “How am I gonna make it via this? how am I gonna survive this present day or this, this second?” It’s not straightforward; it’s gonna be laborious. You possibly can’t simply type of batten down the hatches and wait until the storm is over, you’ve gotten a possibility to flee and possibly you by no means do. However the anxiousness factor, yeah it’s powerful, you simply carry it with you and I do suppose it begins early. I feel that we do be taught these issues and one by no means absolutely will get cured of hysteria or whether or not you simply actually discover ways to handle it. I imply, this concept of hysteria, as a result of Okay leads a really anxious life, he by no means is aware of what’s across the nook however typically this was additionally a call that I made and was type of actually supported by my editor. 

Like one thing else all the time occurs. There’s all the time one other beat, there’s like another complication that Okay didn’t foresee, since you by no means know what’s gonna occur from second to second And so he doesn’t ever have that luxurious of  with the ability to take a breather and simply say, “All proper, that’s over with,” as a result of it’s by no means over, as a result of there’s all the time one thing else coming across the nook, an instance, I feel, could be within the practice when he’s escaping the farm and getting lastly getting again to town, and he thinks like he’s clear After which the goat’s there, like, you realize, like this was, that was imagined to be his escape, like that will have been the tip of the story, besides that it’s not, you realize, there’s There’s one other complication, one other beat. 

PEREZ: I wished to ask about how that dialog together with your editor went. Was it like, “Hey, you should have a cheerful ending right here,” or?

CLEMENT: No, completely. She, she’s fully in opposition to pleased endings, which is why we get alongside so properly, I had one of many tales, and it had type of a fairly, like I wouldn’t name it like a fairy story ending, however it was form of a resolved ending possibly, a impartial conclusion and my editor was like “no, you’ll be able to’t do this. That doesn’t belong on this universe” And she or he was proper. so I modified that however it was undoubtedly once I considered it for a second. I assumed, yeah after all, that doesn’t make any sense in any respect. It doesn’t belong right here, you realize, this isn’t the world. This can be a world the place he lives and he’ll proceed to be clothed and fed and stuff like that. Okay shouldn’t be in mortal hazard, however it’s by no means a cheerful ending. It may possibly’t ever be a cheerful ending. It may simply be an ending, you realize, after which he goes to sleep after which there’s the subsequent day, and, and we’re extra horrible crap will occur, yeah. 

PEREZ: Lastly and I wished to ask you why a e-book like Okay is Bother Once more is an effective e-book for our hectic and disturbing occasions
CLEMENT: I feel that it’s attainable to learn Okay and Okay tales and really feel such as you’re not the one individual, you realize, affected by anxiousness or apprehensive about being laid low with the world that you simply stay in and I feel understanding that might make you’re feeling just a little bit higher. Simply understanding that, properly, what do they are saying, distress loves firm, proper? so possibly understanding that everybody’s depressing, and we will all type of relate to. Coping with the every day type of mundane terror, that is one thing we will all relate to one another, a degree we will all relate to on that’s a approach to really feel higher. 

PEREZ: And also you suppose that’s an excellent message for youths?  Do you suppose they’ll get it?

CLEMENT: We’ll discover out, I suppose. I feel youngsters can relate to the e-book. I feel youngsters and adults can learn it. And properly, not each child’s gonna really feel that manner, however I feel, it’s a unusual e-book for positive, and there’s a darkness in it however there’s additionally humor, and I feel that’s relatable sufficient. Someplace down the road, everybody’s had a horrible trainer or a horrible incident at college, or a struggle with their dad and mom, or one thing that appeared that appears fully inexplicable, and also you don’t perceive how that occurred: “Why is my world so horrible?” Is there a child on the market who has not felt that in some unspecified time in the future? I don’t know. I doubt it. I feel at that degree, it’s for each child and each child ought to learn it proper now. Or purchase it and browse it and you realize, and for those who don’t agree with it, get again to me. Purchase two copies, let any person else know, check it out as a present!

 Take a look at Okay is in Bother Once more out on by  Little, Brown Ink right here or your native comedian retailer!  

Editorial notice: Within the unique interview there was a mistake, the improper writer was credited. The right writer is  Little, Brown Ink.
My apologies.